tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2807403883562053852.post839849530878636187..comments2024-03-27T08:40:31.785-06:00Comments on Clayton Cramer.: Distinct Cultural Differences Between Islamist Perspectives and OursClayton Cramerhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/03258083387204776812noreply@blogger.comBlogger10125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2807403883562053852.post-46608372061035078832012-04-29T19:47:41.040-06:002012-04-29T19:47:41.040-06:00Kleiman is a liberal, and admitting that bin Laden...Kleiman is a liberal, and admitting that bin Laden (and not the Saudi monarchy) was behind 9/11 seems a bit hard for him. First he wanted me to make it completely disappear (even though at best there is now serious question about the story), then he is upset about a lack of retractions? I'm not sure that you can make some people happy.Clayton Cramerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03258083387204776812noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2807403883562053852.post-24458623462257195052012-04-29T17:27:51.864-06:002012-04-29T17:27:51.864-06:00I have to say Clayton, you handled it well and hon...I have to say Clayton, you handled it well and honestly, especially with the update. What is Kleiman going on about? And who in the world believes the Saudi Monarchy brought us 9-11? <br /><br />In Kleiman's own blog, he is keeping track of the number of liberal and conservative blogs that have published retractions of this story. He claims that no conservative blog has done so. Perhaps he is trying to further that narrative?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2807403883562053852.post-7687012131675823782012-04-28T09:20:01.066-06:002012-04-28T09:20:01.066-06:001. The Saudi monarchy did not bring us 9/11. Ther...1. The Saudi monarchy did not bring us 9/11. There were a number of Saudi citizens involved, because bin Laden was trying to create hostility towards the Saudi government by the U.S.<br /><br />2. A number of Muslim news organizations carried reports about this. And even now, the Egyptian government's denial is actually pretty carefully worded. It sounds like there were supporters of this proposal.<br /><br />3. You will notice that I used the phrase "Islamists" not "Arabs" or "Egyptians" or "Muslims." The Islamists are one particular segment of Muslim society that supports putting women back into second class status.<br /><br />4. I could have just pulled this back. But I think it is more honest to show people a correction, rather than making it like it never even happened.<br /><br />5. The Saudis are terrified of Arab democracy, very true. But Arab democracy is likely to be something Islamist, not liberal democracy. In this country, we have groups like the ACLU who fight against democracy, because they are terrified that the majority might get its way, and prohibit homosexuality, abortion, pornography, and all the rest of the left's agenda.Clayton Cramerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03258083387204776812noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2807403883562053852.post-35519898699308687272012-04-28T08:43:55.175-06:002012-04-28T08:43:55.175-06:00... because the Saudi monarchy - the wonderful peo...... because the Saudi monarchy - the wonderful people who brought you 9-11 - would never lie, especially about a democratic movement they desperately hope doesn't spread to their own country. <br /><br />Clayton, you got taken in by a hoax because you <em>wanted</em> to believe that Arabs are disgusting. And when it proved not to be true, instead of retracting, you put in a "third update" instead of reflecting how you'd been taken in, and helped spread one more bit of bigotry.Mark Kleimanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07273854901778070873noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2807403883562053852.post-23450059321125112842012-04-27T08:28:12.446-06:002012-04-27T08:28:12.446-06:00Let me also point out that when an Arabic language...Let me also point out that when an Arabic language, Muslim-oriented service like al-Arabiya treats this seriously, it is foolish to assume that this is "bottom-line bogus."Clayton Cramerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03258083387204776812noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2807403883562053852.post-4013069679781594682012-04-27T07:56:38.349-06:002012-04-27T07:56:38.349-06:00This was part of a larger package that does enjoy ...This was part of a larger package that does enjoy significant support among Islamists: lowering the marriage age to 14, and reducing opportunities for education and employment for women.Clayton Cramerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03258083387204776812noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2807403883562053852.post-28735581146309615862012-04-27T01:36:36.136-06:002012-04-27T01:36:36.136-06:00I don't know why you would be skeptical that t...I don't know why you would be skeptical that the story is bottom-line bogus. You see it all the time in this country, where some state or even federal legislator proposes some weird law that the press then falls all over itself covering. It is not at all unusual at all to see such stories breathlessly covering all the details of the law and the implications if it should take effect, while somehow never getting around to discussing that the legislation has no support beyond the attention seeking media whore who proposed it.Anon Y. Mousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2807403883562053852.post-10640917704313038212012-04-26T20:49:28.401-06:002012-04-26T20:49:28.401-06:00I suggest you read the analysis of this story in t...I suggest you read the analysis of this story in <a href="http://www.csmonitor.com/World/Backchannels/2012/0426/Egypt-necrophilia-law-Hooey-utter-hooey" rel="nofollow">the Christian Science Monitor here</a>.Bozo Fausthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07735484889785668942noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2807403883562053852.post-42710647647194158342012-04-26T12:24:00.810-06:002012-04-26T12:24:00.810-06:00I'm pretty sure that women in Egypt are stoned...I'm pretty sure that women in Egypt are stoned to death if they make noise, move, or breathe during sex also, so it could be difficult to tell whether or not they're dead while making the Allah Approved version of sweet, sweet love to them.RevGreghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11627218929198779685noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2807403883562053852.post-34776865677982974102012-04-26T11:24:25.564-06:002012-04-26T11:24:25.564-06:00Celebrate diversity!!
(/sarcasm)Celebrate diversity!!<br />(/sarcasm)Bikeboyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17379272663647894409noreply@blogger.com